Keep Vista or roll back to Windows XP? That is the question

The recent news that Dell is going to be offering Windows XP on 6 models of new PCs (again) wasn't surprising to me.  Dell reportedly made the policy change in response to customer voting on their IdeaStorm website where customers can enter suggestions to the PC maker.  Dell had only been offering Vista on new PCs since it was released to OEMs earlier this year and the decision to offer XP again was not something that Microsoft was happy to hear, I'm sure.  I have been running Vista on my Fujitsu P1610 since early this year and while there are many things I really like about the new OS there is at least one time each day that I wish I still had Windows XP installed. 

I'm not exaggerating, at least once per day during my mobile meanderings Vista does something that holds me up and makes me sit there twiddling my thumbs.  When this happens there are usually other people present who have to wait for the Fuji to come back to life too.  I realize that the P1610 is not a powerhouse PC with it's 1.2 GHz Core Solo processor, 1 GB of memory and integrated graphics but it was tagged as "Vista Capable" and it does run Aero Glass so I would expect at least acceptable performance and most of the time I do get that.  My quandary emphasizes that old adage that the whole is only as strong as the weakest link in the chain.

First the good things about Vista that keeps me coming back day after day.  The Tablet PC functionality is outstanding and makes interfacing with the Fuji so much easier than XP in every way.  The new Tablet Input Panel (TIP) not only looks better but it works much more productively and makes the Tablet functions feel like an integrated part of the OS, which they are.  The ability to train the recognizer is a tremendous improvement over the XP version and makes the handwriting recognition even more accurate, believe it or not.

I find the whole Vista interface easier to operate with either the pen or my finger (the P1610 is a touch screen Tablet) in almost every way.  There are a lot of interface improvements and I won't list them all here as that's not the purpose of this article.  Suffice it to say that I really like the interface and would hate to give it up.

So with all the good things in Vista why do I keep coming back to the question of rolling back to Windows XP?  If I had to sum it up in one word it would be unpredictability.  Vista runs fine almost all the time and the performance is fine even on my anemic hardware.  The problem is that I can't predict when it's going to enter into one of its disk thrashing fits that totally paralyzes me.  I've documented these thrashing episodes and they can last 5 minutes or more, with me sitting there like a fool, needing to get something done and not able to do so.  I've had observers comment on these bouts and ask what's causing them, something I can't answer.

Little actions that execute perfectly under Windows XP can trigger these paralytic episodes, but not every time.  Docking and undocking the Fuji can be an exercise in frustration, with the screen changes as it connects to my external monitor sometimes triggering bizarre behavior and total system stoppage.  Docking the Fuji can take 30 seconds to make these adjustments or it can take 5 minutes.  It's very strange.  Even undocking the Fuji which should just involve it disengaging itself from the peripherals attached to the dock can be quick or painfully slow.  There's no rhyme nor reason and I often feel like I'm flipping a coin to determine if it will be a quick and normal operation or a slow and irritating action.  This just isn't right.

Rotating the screen orientation is something I do a lot during the day as I go from slate to laptop modes and back and I experience the same frustrations.  I never know if it's going to be quick and painless or productivity halting.  It's the same thing either entering Standby or resuming from it.  I'm ready to throw the Fuji into the bag after telling it to standby and I have to sit and wait to make sure it totally shuts down.  I can't throw it into the bag while it's shutting down because if it takes 5 minutes it will get super-hot in the bag.

Every time one of these system stoppages occurs the disk is thrashing so much I'm afraid something is going to go wrong and it will not come back.  It has always come back so far (knock on wood) but the fear is there, heavy disk thrashing has never had a happy ending prior to Vista.  I cannot believe that with the programs I have running most of the time that there is a need for all of this paging or whatever is causing this slowdown.  I can think of no good reason for the paging if that's what it is because I never have more than three programs running at once, I've never liked keeping a bunch of programs open.

So I continue on, every day loving that which is Vista until it makes me hate it so.  And every day I swear I'm going to roll back to Windows XP.  If it wasn't such a big ordeal to switch back I would have already done it.  And I'm sure that once I rolled back to XP I would be lamenting how much I miss Vista.

Comments

[GoodThings2Life]

I completely understand what you mean... I experienced the same issues during the beta period (up through and including the final RC releases). Ultimately, despite the benefits of the TabletPC functionality, there was far more to irritate me than impress me, and I concluded that SP1 was the next time I would give any attention to Vista.

[Sam]

I keep hearing folk say that 2gb of memory is the bare minimum to run Vista successfully. Vista supposedly has a dynamic memory management system what with Superfetch and Readyboost - poor drivers may well be causing problems as the system tries to allocate or free memory resources. Even on my win xp tablet pc edition Fujitsu, I've experienced these inexplicable hangs and switched off everything from indexing services to automatic updates in an attempt to resolve them.

[Fernando]

James: I experience the same things you do with Vista on my P1610. The docking/undocking; the slowness in going to Sleep mode (only to find when I get home that it is incredibly hot in my bag); the freezing when moving between Office applications (it takes so long).

I don't know if its a RAM thing, an OS thing or whatever. Here at the University, our IT people are telling the same thing as GoodThings2Life says, that they will not move onto Vista at least until SP1 comes out. I think I understand why...

With all this said though, and you may be in the same boat. Should we go back? I don't think so, this is partially about learning as you go, and taking the good with the bad. And you have done a good job of pointing out the good, which outweighs (IMHO) the bad.

[Hitchhiker]

It is very hard to see the value that Vista brings to computing. If I upgrade,I basically make my hardware obsolete or inoperative due to lack of drivers. Like most uses, I will probably never scratch the surface of the functionality offered by even Windows XP. I would like to propose that operating systems get smaller and more efficient with each release Just as electronics get smaller and faster with each new generation. Call it a crazy dream, but it would even be cool to be able to cut down the bloat of the Operating System by deselecting more options at installation.would like to see a trend of smaller and faster vs. bloated, unneeded functionality. (.02) Hitch

[Mike]

This makes me wonder if I should even consider an UMPC with Vista.

[Tax Man]

I probably didn't give Vista enough time to grow on me, but after only about a week, I re-imaged my Q1 and re-installed XP. For me, the killer was listening to music on Windows Media Player and having the controls be totally unresponsive. Say I'm jamming to music and get a phone call. I reach for the volume and nothing happens for 10-15 seconds. Not good. For me, either Vista is not good enough for my computer or my computer is not good enough for Vista. Either way, this box is staying XP for now.

[Hitchhiker]

The UMPC experience is great! Please do not let my frustration with software development prevent you from joining the party. I have a Fujitsu P1610 I and would mot trade it for anything currently on the market. I just wish the operating systems were bit more efficient with resources, that's all.

[Mike Cane]

I have just one Very, Very Stupid Question. OK, I've warned you. Now here it is:

Will anything that currently runs under XP run under Vista?

I haven't paid too much attention (obviously!), but the thing that concerns me is obsoleting all the current tools that I use under XP that are just indispensable for me.

I use Firefox and a bunch of extensions, I use FLV Player and vlc, I use a free photo editing program called Photo Toolkit, and others. I'd hate to have these all trashed just for a new OS (an OS which seems like it not too hot anyway in terms of getting things done quickly).

OK, you may laugh now.

But then reply!

[James Kendrick]

Mike, I don't have any programs that will not work under Vista. In the beta period there were quite a few of them that wouldn't work but now everyone has updated their programs to make sure they will work. Of course, I don't use all the free junk that you use so YMMV. Firefox rocks in Vista, however, along with all the various extensions I use.

[Mickey Segal]

Lots of things don't quite work well in Vista.

Many drivers don't quite work (see http://mobilepcwiki.com/mpc/index.php?title=Motion/LS800/Windows_Vista_Clean_Install_Notes for some examples).

Many programs don't quite work either. Windows Mail has a bunch of serious bugs. Firefox has the hyperlink bug detailed at http://kb.mozillazine.org/Windows_error_opening_Internet_shortcut_or_local_HTML_file_-_Firefox and some extensions don't work (most notably for Tablet PC users, GeckoTIP). And of course Apple hasn't made it out to CompUSA to get a copy of Vista, and offers QuickTime only for Windows XP and 2000, and asks "Running QuickTime on VISTA? Give us your feedback." on http://www.apple.com/quicktime/download/win.html.

I've been recommending that people get Vista only if they are a developer, a Tablet PC user, or need the new computer now. However, many Tablet PC users, when they hear of the level of problems, decide to wait for the Vista experience to be improved.

[Ctitanic]

The only way to progress is going forward. Going back is not an option. I know that´s hard to find solutions and workarounds but hey... are not you a MVP?

The only way to get something fix is keeping it in use. That will serve you as reminder that something is broken and and need to be fixed. To work under that pressure will make you to work pressuring others for a fix. ;)

[Mike Cane]

Everyone raves about the TabPC experience in Vista for UMPCs. Maybe I'm just an eejit, but aside from the HWR, I've yet to see the big deal. Maybe I just need to get the OneNote religion?

[Lorie Ghamy]

And many video editing programs don't work with Vista or without full functionnalities...

Not able to run too : many TV Tuner USB key or PCI card like ADS Tech models (some of them) for exemple...

Repeat after me:

Vista is good for you now !

100 x again !

[Tax Man]

I guess CTitanic makes a good point that if you are going to be a Microsoft MVP and a mobile tech blogger, you don't attact a lot of readers with posts about how "Windows 2000 works just dandy for me". I guess the rest of us don't have to worry about that. My sense is that you guys put up with a lot that doesn't work as well as XP to enjoy those few things that work better in Vista and the additional eye candy of the newest UI. I've been there and I am not being critical. I just don't feel like my Q1 is the best place to fight that battle. Maybe I just have pretty handwriting but XP seems to interpret it pretty well. YMMV and probably does. My land rover only gets 14 mpg. I sure hope your mileage is better. :)

[DBL]

My guess is that one of two things is the culprit:

(a) You are letting your hard drive get too full, thus forcing your system to scrounge around to swap memory in and out in an extremely inefficient way. You try moving 1 ton of groceries from your porch to your kitchen, one spoonful at a time -- your visitors are going to be waiting for you a loooong time. Turn that spoonful into a shopping cart, by always leaving about 5-10% of your drive space (and at least 2GB no matter what) free at any one time.

(b) You are just running too many apps at the same time and leaving them open. Try quitting all open apps before docking and undocking, see if that makes a difference. If it does, it's a big sign.

Also note that items (a) and (b) can work in concert to produce a deadly, crippling slowdown.

The reason that this happens with Vista and didn't with XP is probably because the greater resources required by Vista put it closer to the redline than XP (in both hard drive space used and in free memory available for apps), so your old habits which stood you in good stead, now take you over that line occasionally.

Free up more space, and run fewer apps at once -- if that doesn't fix it, then it's probably just a Vista bug that will get patched eventually.

[Arechek]

That disk activity is because of poorly written desktop search. Did you try to limit number of items indexed, for example only Outlook folders ?

[bobm]

Ctitanic said:

The only way to get something fix is keeping it in use. That will serve you as reminder that something is broken and and need to be fixed. To work under that pressure will make you to work pressuring others for a fix.

That's well and good if there was a way to get someone to fix the issues but I don't have the phone number of any MS developers who I can call and get a patch from. Heck, I don't even know if the slowdown is even on anyone's radar (I'm seeing it on my HP w/ 2G of memory when running virtual applications).

I can't afford the downtime, exposure at this point in my life so I'm staying with XP for as long as possible.

The conspirancy theorist in my wonders what MS did between the betas and gold version that broke so much stuff.

[spinedoc]

This disk thrashing happens quite frequently on my P1610 as well. The odd thing is that I have a sony laptop which has lower proc specs than the fujitsu that runs vista with no hiccups, BUT it has 2gb of memory. I think Fujitsu made a HUGE mistake not offering 2gb.

It is more than annoying, it is as JK says completely productivity limiting. I have turned off most of aero and besides the freezing, the P1610 actually runs vista pretty admirably.

[Fernando]

If it is a memory issue with the P1610, is there any way to enable some virtual memory to offset this problem?

[MiniMage]

For me, the solution will be dual-boot. I'm ok with Vista on my ViewSonic V1250, but my much newer Asus R2H is having connectivity issues, with the built-in items, anyway.

[borax99 (Alain C.)]

None of the above posts make me feel any better. Months after receiving my 1610, I finally received my upgrade DVD's last week. Friday night, I downloaded Norton Ghost, installed it and imaged my fully functional XP Tablet environment. A couple of quick tests to verify that my machine could boot from my USB optical drive, and I went to sleep happily looking forward to installing the Vista upgrade on Saturday morning.

Saturday morning, I fired up the Fujitsu disc and started following the instructions. Upgrade the BIOS? Check. Manually uninstall some of the incompatible drivers on top of the ones that get automatically removed? Check.

Trepidation, anticipation. With the 1610 connected to the world at large thanks to my Kyocera KPC-650 EVDO PC Card, I started up the bona fide Microsoft upgrade.

I selected upgrade over a clean install because life's too short to reinstall all my software and shuffle my data around.

A hair over 90 minutes later, the whole thing came to a crashing halt, with a typically mediocre Microsoft error message stating that the upgrade could not proceed because a required driver couldn't be found but, not to worry, no information was saved. Thanks, MS, for providing exactly zero information about which driver might have been at fault!

Then I clicked OK to exit the install only to realize (a) that by uninstalling all the good XP Fujitsu drivers I now had a deeply brain-damaged $3000 hunk of junk and (b) there was no way to connect via the EVDO card anymore.

So I did what any reasonably sane person would have done and Ghosted my way back to a working tablet.

I have reason to believe Microsoft doesn't always play nice with EVDO - I have had Windows updates fail over EVDO then work without a hitch on slow-as-molasses dialup. To prove a point, I'll try the upgrade again next week using a regular cable connection. Once I've proven to my satisfaction that this was a Microsoft issue, I'll gladly revert to XP Tablet and wait for SP1 before wasting any more time on this nonsense.

As far as enhancements to tablet functionality go, make mine FITALY !!!

[Dave]

No clue what the issue is... I run the latest and greatest OS X (Tiger) and will jump to upgrade my laptop to Leopard on DAY ONE! I bet I upgrade the rest of the systems and my three servers withing 60 days. I support OS X (Tiger) 26 systems in a medical practice and keep them all at the latest version of OS. I run one iMac with Boot Camp to boot into XP when needed, but we only use Windows about 10 mintues a day.

Get a life, get a Mac.

[Helen Gurring]

Jesus man do yourself a favour and just buy a Mac! Every person I know is about to buy one or already has. EVERY SINGLE ONE SWEARS THEY WILL NEVER USE WINDOWS AGAIN.

If you feel some desperate need to have Windows Vista or XP at hand use Parallels. Once you start using a Mac you'll NEVER go back and wonder why you put up with the abuse for so long. Then you can sell that laptop to some poor soul before it's worthless.

[Karel Paiche]

Wow you would think that with Longhorn/Vista five years late, you'd get more than a chrome plated turd, not much of an improvement from the brushed metal turd that was XP. In fact all things considered at least XP worked much of the time while Vista wastes four hours of my time on average each day.

[John in Norway]

Okay all you MAC fanboys (and girls), I'll take your advice. Now, where can I buy a Mac Tablet? About 5-9 inch screen?

Thanks in advance for your suggestions.